A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

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A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by SteveS » Sun Mar 10, 2019 3:33 pm

The New York Stock Exchange (NYSE) was initiated by an agreement on 17 May 1792.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buttonwood_Agreement

But, what time for this May 17 1792 NYSE chart? Back in the 70’s when I first began my astrological studies and market research for a company, I was given a timed chart done by Louise McWhirter from a book, ‘Theory of Stock Market Forecasting’. The time was 7:52 AM LMT.

In my market research back in the 70’s, I discovered various people believed McWhirter was non-other than the legendary market guru—W.D. Gann, who I have researched thoroughly and know for a fact he was an astute astrologer. I also have seen copies of several written documents by Gann he predicted the Stock Market Crash of 1929, years before the Crash.
Some believe that “Louise McWhirter” was only an alias of famous market forecaster W. D. Gann.[8]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louise_McWhirter

It dawned on me over the weekend, I never really researched McWhirter’s May 17 1792, 7:52 AM NYSE chart--so I looked closely for the first time. Since I knew with Secondary Progressions (SP) very rarely in the history of anything will you see angular hits with Secondary Progressed angles, I calculated this 1792 NYSE chart to Oct 24 1929 (the day of the crash) using Solar Arc in Long, and BINGO!!!

SP Moon 07,38 Aries (Q2)
SP Saturn 08,23 Aries
SP DSC 08,08 Aries
SP Nep 06,59 Lib
t. Sun 07,03 Lib

This chart proves to me we have with very high %, a timed chart for the NYSE. I will do more research into the past and the future.

https://imgur.com/W2pdYnU
Last edited by SteveS on Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: A good possibility for a timed chart of the NYSE

Post by SteveS » Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:57 am

I just noticed something which I don’t really understand exactly what McWhirter (Gann) is doing with the Nodal Cycles in the Stock Market . Go to this same link below which I posted in my original post with this topic.

Scroll down to “Gann’s Financial Timetable” and look at the “Year’s” Graph. Note “Major Low” and the Year 2009. 2009 was the year the Market indeed made a Major Low from the 2007 mortgage crises crash. Now look at the “Major Top” years 2017 & 2018, noting 2018 appears to have already made a Major Top. Now go to the “Big Crash” section and note the years 2019 & 2020.

If we indeed do see a “Big Crash” in 2019 or 2020-- no way Trump is elected again in 2020.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louise_McWhirter

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Re: A good possibility for a timed chart of the NYSE

Post by Jupiter Sets at Dawn » Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:19 am

Louise McWhirter was not Gann under an alias. They just both used astrology and the eclipse cycles.

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Re: A good possibility for a timed chart of the NYSE

Post by SteveS » Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:04 am

Thanks JSAD, this helps me a-lot for deciding certain factors. Oct 24 (Thursday) & Oct 25 (Friday) 1929 the market started its collapse. Below is a link to the Oct 25, 1929 NQ2 for McWhirter’s timed Natal for the NYSE. This NQ2 absolutely nails the symbolism for the beginning collapse of the Stock Market in Oct 1929.

Oct 25 1929 NQ2 for NYSE:
https://imgur.com/uF8ZRW7

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Re: A good possibility for a timed chart of the NYSE

Post by Jim Eshelman » Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:44 pm

That's a very impressive quotidian!

I'd had a chart for NYSE for years for the same date but for noon. Your time seems more reasonable for when a market would open, though noon was not unreasonable. Oh, I just looked - the noon time also seems to have come from you. My saved notes say:
"The Buttowood Agreement" SteveS quotes Ken Bowser as saying:

On May 17, 1792, apparently at noon according to custom, under the branches of a buttonwood tree in Lower Manhattan, twenty-four traders agreed to buy and sell only to each other, government securities, bank, insurance and canal company shares. The horoscope for this agreement is responsive to transits, and while it has been rectified often, the information available to this writer confirms that the original members of the New York Stock Exchange regularly met at noon. There appears to be no reason to meddle with a horoscope calculated for that time.
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Re: A good possibility for a timed chart of the NYSE

Post by SteveS » Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:18 am

Jim wrote:
That's a very impressive quotidian!
Indeed Jim! With that Oct 24 & 25 1929 NQ2 which nailed the beginning of the 1929 Stock Market Collapse, I am now convinced we have a very important timed May 17 7:52 LMT AM 1792 Chart for the NYSE, thanks to McWhirter's work. This very important personal discovery of the McWhirter NYSE Chart is coming in with my Solar Arc ME=Natal Sun-Uranus. I also now believe we can take the NQ2 charting combined with NQ2 Moon and have a high probability for projecting the beginning of the next collapse in the NYSE for 2019 or early 2020. Theoretically, this is possible with Fagan’s discovery for Quotidian charting as a technique for Sidereal Astrology. The Market is waiting for the ‘Right’ Sidereal Astrology TIME to fall apart. I sure do need your Sidereal Astrology insight for this topic-- for my memory fails me at times.

Jim, I also want to make an emphatic statement: “Gann’s Financial Timetable” provided in a link with this topic is not to be ignored! I ran across this same “Timetable” in the 80’s when I was doing intense NYSE market research with Gann’s material, but in a different format. I have done NYSE historical research with this “Timetable” and it is reliable from a cyclical standpoint. Gann derived this Timetable using the Tropical Z, but I think the Sidereal Z will produce the same table. If you understand what Gann is doing with this “Timetable” astrologically, please offer us an explanation with your keen astronomical insight.

Jim, if we see new market highs going into the Autumn of 2019, we need to pay attention for possible important Top, and do our Sidereal Astrology homework. I do know this with my research into Gann’s material: Gann repeatedly said very important market tops are made in the 9th years of certain Decades. But, Gann never explained the “certain” for the Decades. Jim, another thing you and I know with your great work with Sidereal Mundane Astrology: Our 2021 Capsolar is very malefic. If Gann’s “Timetable is going to be correct for the Decade of the 2010’s with a Market Collapse beginning in 2019-20, then % are very high we will see a Major Bottom in NYSE in 2021 with malefic/negative financial news. Markets always put on major bottoms with very malefic/negative news.

If anyone knows how to take “Gann’s Financial Timetable” found in the following link-- copy and post (same format) in this topic—I sure would appreciate.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louise_McWhirter

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Re: A good possibility for a timed chart of the NYSE

Post by Jim Eshelman » Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:20 am

Steve, what was her source for this data? Ken B had a good argument for the traditional time; I'm curious whether there is actual historic basis for this "new" time?
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Re: A good possibility for a timed chart of the NYSE

Post by SteveS » Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:08 am

Jim, I simply don't know. All I remember is I traveled many places, mainly Chicago, doing intense research with Gann and the Commodities market---not the NYSE! I accumulated 2 large boxes of Gann Material which I was digging through this past weekend. I do know this: Gann was a member of the NYSE, and Gann always started his astrological radicals with the TIME of the 'First Trade' with the birth of any market. This past weekend I went to https://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Business:_NYSE, and scrolled down to bottom of page and noticed a McWhiter Time for the NYSE. This jolted my memory making me think: Wait a minute, I have ran across this name in my past market research years ago—so I started digging through my Gann stuff and pulled out a NYSE chart by McWhirter—astro databank had miss spelled McWhirter name to McWhiter. Then I did an internet search for McWhirter and came-up with the link I posted. On this link it said McWhirter rectified the time to 7:52, but then I saw on the link McWhirter may have been an alias for Gann. What puzzles the hell out of me? How did a McWhirter NYSE chart get in my Gann stuff from the 80’s??? My cousin and I spent months researching a-lot of Gann material and realized Gann was definitely using Financial Astrology methods in the markets. I spent many hours on the phone and meetings in Chicago with a Mr. Jones who bought ALL of Gann’s material from Gann’s Partner in Miami when Gann passed away. I got all of my Gann Material for Jones. But, I do know the main reason I did not pay any attention to McWhirter’s NYSE chart in the 80’S: I was simply not interested in the Stock Market, only commodities.

Jim, be sure and see my next post.

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Re: A good possibility for a timed chart of the NYSE

Post by SteveS » Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:10 am

I am very excited to realize I have what I consider a timed birth chart of the NYSE. I have had this chart in my possession since the 80’s not realizing how I got the chart in the 80’s, but some circumstances last weekend made me realize I had hunted down this chart many years ago. Long elapses of Time can make the mind forget things, some, very important from a research standpoint.

I now want to continue doing some historical spot checking of ‘outstanding incidents’ with the NYSE correlating these ‘incidents’ back to proven techniques of Sidereal Astrology, offering further proof of a valid timed chart for the NYSE.

Here is a link discussing the largest one day drop in the entire history of the NYSE. On Oct 19 1987, the Dow lost 22% of its value. This one day has been labeled by the news media as: Black Monday.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Monday_(1987)

This was the single most ‘stunning/shocking’ (Pluto) one day ‘incident’ to ever happen in the history of the NYSE. This is clearly seen in the Solar Quotidian (SQ) chart for Oct 19 1987, but before we can calculate a SQ chart we have to calculate the 1987 Sidereal Solar Return (SSR) chart for the NYSE. The 1987 SSR for the NYSE is absolutely ‘outstanding’ and defines itself as an ‘outstanding incident’ SSR by Jim’s teaching guidelines.

This 1987 NYSE SSR features a very rare Moon-Neptune Paran, probably the only Moon-Neptune Paran SSR in the entire history of the NYSE. Years ago when Jim was writing his ‘Financial Panic Report’ for the NYSE, he isolated and identified Moon-Neptune as a clear signature for financial panics. So, we clearly see with the Moon-Neptune Paran with the NYSE 1987 SSR, a ‘panic’ prophesied to occur sometime within the NYSE solar year. But when during the solar year? NYSE Oct 19 1987 (Black Monday) Solar Quotidian (SQ) timed this outstanding day incident with Pluto partile cnj the SQ, partile 135 SQ Moon.

NYSE 1987 SSR:

https://imgur.com/3HKovIv
Note:
Moon (MC)-Neptune (DSC) Paran, for the PANIC!
Neptune partile 60 Pluto
Moon 1,24 square Mercury
Saturn partile cnj West Point in RA!

Now NYSE Oct 19 1987 Solar Quotidian (Black Monday):

https://imgur.com/rMverLQ

SQ Pluto partile cnj SQ ASC; partile 135 SQ Moon
Saturn partile cnj Vertex axis.

*Jim has taught if there is to be any kind of ‘stunning/shocking’ incident, we must see Pluto prominent in a Sidereal Astrology chart.

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Re: A good possibility for a timed chart of the NYSE

Post by SteveS » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:19 am

Looking into the future with this chart, I see no earth shattering astrological configurations until Jan 2021. The main aspect happening on this chart is p. Uranus is partile 180 Natal Pluto which is probably a dormant ticking time bomb awaiting for sp Moon to partile cnj this p. Uranus 180 to r. Pluto in Jan 2021, but does not happen with any angles. Secondary progressed Mercury is partile cnj secondary progressed Asc in 2021, probably symbolizing media attention or increased trading activity. I certainly see no panic type depression symbolism in the future with this chart with Sidereal Astrology. My best guess, we will see in 2021 some major Uranus-Pluto changes with the NYSE with the sp Moon-Uranus Natal Pluto. This indicates to me, other than normal market corrections/activity, expect the status quo with the NYSE.

Using Solar Arcs, I do see an interesting angular aspect Ap. 8 2020:

SA ASC 5,22 Aqu 90 NATAL SUN 5,22 Tau

This SA ASC 90 NATAL SUN hit is highly symbolic of recognition/event stuff, and is the only near term (1 year) symbolic aspect possibly timing Gann’s collapsing Market “Timetable” with the years 2019-2020, but only TIME knows for sure.

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Re: A good possibility for a timed chart of the NYSE

Post by SteveS » Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:59 am

Jim wrote from his “Financial Astrology Report” about the Financial Panic for May 10 1837—primarily pertaining to the Banking Industry/Stocks. I am going to try and find some detailed price history for the Wall Street Bank Stocks for 1836-1837.
Year: Cansolar
For New York, the prior (1836) Cansolar became the effective Chart of the Year due to the Capsolar’s dormancy. It told the banking story dramatically.
• Moon-Neptune opposition (0°02')
o Neptune is on Eastpoint (0°16')
o Moon is on Westpoint (1°02')
• Pluto square Ascendant (0°38')
Here is the 1836 New York Cansolar Chart # 1. After Jim did his Sidereal Mundane Astrology work with Financial Panics, he concluded the leading signature for financial panics is Moon-Neptune. It takes the wild speculative fever of Neptune to inflate a financial ‘Bubble,’ which always ends in a financial panic.
Note the partile Moon-Neptune 180, partile cnj the East/West point’s axis.

1: https://imgur.com/ICmW1sC

Since I now feel strongly we have an accurate timed chart for the NYSE, I wanted to spot check some of the financial panics which have historically occurred in USA with this NYSE chart related to Sidereal Astrology teachings. The Panic of 1837 occurred on May 10th. Lets look at the NYSE Sidereal Solar Return (SSR) for May 18 1836, which was the solar year for the May 10 1837 financial panic on Wall Street. And then look at the NYSE Solar Quotidian Chart for May 10 1837, the day for this Panic. I find it most interesting using Jim's Solar Return teachings!

First, Jim teaches a Sidereal Solar Return is ‘locked into collusion with its Natal Chart.’ 1836 NYSE SSR chart # 2 below, inside wheel 1836 NYSE SSR, outside wheel NYSE Natal:

2: https://imgur.com/sJaU2Nb

Note the tight SSR NYSE Venus-Jupiter cnj—with NYSE SSR Jupiter partile cnj NYSE Natal ASC. With this SSR Venus-Jupiter cnj ‘locked into collusion’ with NYSE Natal Asc for the entire solar year of 1836, we see a driving benefic force which led to this NYSE Bank Bubble which burst on May 10 1837. Also note NYSE 1836 SSR Moon at 10,32 Gem on NYSE SSR MC. This secondary progressed 1836 NYSE SSR Moon will be an important timing factor for this Panic on May 10 1837 with the May 10 1837 Solar Quotidian chart.


Chart # 3 below is the May 10th 1837 NYSE Sidereal Solar Return Quotidian (SQ), the exact day of the Panic.

Note on the day of this financial panic, May 10 1837, NYSE SSR Moon has progressed to a partile cnj to NYSE SSR Venus-Jupiter, partile cnj NYSE Natal Asc, all partile 90 NYSE SSR Pluto! Simply amazing! More solid Sidereal Astrology proof for a valid timed NYSE Birth Chart.

3: https://imgur.com/r6toYLN

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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by Jim Eshelman » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:05 am

Overall, this is a pretty impressive run of charts!
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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by SteveS » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:11 am

Jim wrote:
Overall, this is a pretty impressive run of charts!
Indeed Jim. I will keep looking at the historical financial panics you analyzed in your Sidereal Mundane Astrology Report pertaining to Financial Astrology.

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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by Jim Eshelman » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:20 am

You've got the whole original list we worked with. Recently, I compiled a list of lesser (but important) financial collapses that you might want to zip through as well. (I'll eventually be adding them to SMA once I figure how to integrate them with the others. They are slightly different kinds of events with slightly different patterns, and if I just pile them all in together they'll jumble the statistics for that kind of event. In any event, I found them quite interesting on their own.)

viewtopic.php?f=49&t=2781
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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by SteveS » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:43 am

8-) I will definitely analyze em Jim. Just discovered this about the 2008 Great Recession:

Jim writes from his Financial Astrology Report pertaining to the collapse of prices in the NYSE in the Autumn of 2008 related to New York’s 2008 Cansolar :
Quarter: Cansolar
For New York, all three malefics – Neptune, Saturn, and Mars – are tightly angular, in combination with aspects that appear to show accelerated transactions and personal loss.
• Moon-Mercury opposition (0°03')
• Neptune rises (1°25')
• Saturn on Westpoint (1°56')
• Mars square Midheaven (0°58')
o Mars-Saturn conjunction (0°50' in mundo)
• Venus sets (7°57')
o Venus/Saturn midpoint on Descendant (0°18')
o Venus/Mars midpoint on Descendant (0°43')
Chart below is the 2008 NYSE Sidereal Solar Return (inside wheel), and Natal NYSE (outside wheel).
Jim, this one blows my Sidereal Astrology mind! Note SSR Mars 1,13 cnj SSR MC, but more so, note NYSE Natal Saturn-Neptune forming a Paran on the Horizon of NYSE 2008 SSR! No need to look any further—we see the same NYSE Natal Saturn-Neptune involved which was on the Horizon for the Secondary Progressed NYSE for the 1929 Collapse.

https://imgur.com/LUzNtQk

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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by Jim Eshelman » Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:59 pm

Wow.
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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by SteveS » Fri Mar 15, 2019 8:26 am

Jim teaches a Sidereal Solar Return (SSR) is ‘locked into collusion with its natal chart,’ and I have demonstrated with other chart examples in this topic this is true. Note in the b-wheel below the 2022 NYSE SSR (inside wheel), the tight cnj of SSR Mars/Neptune=Natal MC (outside wheel) with SSR Jupiter 1,19 cnj SSR Zenith.

This has high % for symbolizing a wild expansionary speculative year for the NYSE. Also, imo, good % for producing the largest correction in prices since the major bottom of 2009.

https://imgur.com/s79EBHN

Paraphrasing McWhirter who discovered this timed NYSE chart:
McWhirter maintained that one should pay attention when a planet moves to the Asc and MC of the NYSE. Similarly, since MC of the NYSE chart was in Pisces, which is ruled by Neptune, she also thought that aspects of Neptune are important.

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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by SteveS » Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:44 am

The largest correction (20%) we have seen in the NYSE since the major bottom of March 2009 was beginning with the Oct 4 2018 top which was perfectly timed by NYSE Secondary (SP) Moon.

Oct 4 2018:
NYSE SP Moon 04,16 Cancer
Natal NYSE Saturn 04,32 Aries

As this correction matured to its end in late Dec 2018, it became panic- like from a psychological standpoint which was timed with a maturing NYSE SP MOON to its exact 90 to Natal (NA) Neptune:

SP NYSE Moon 05,52 Can
Na NYSE Neptune 05,52 Lib.

Without a doubt, the Master aspect of the 1792 NYSE chart is the 1,20 eclipto opposition of Saturn-Neptune or partile mundo 180 of this same aspect. When we see this NYSE Saturn-Neptune 180 appear on/near the angles of NYSE Sidereal Solar Returns or NYSE Secondary Progressed angles, or SP NYSE Moon-- Stock Market Crashes are timed!

More later---

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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by SteveS » Tue Mar 19, 2019 7:03 am

More Sidereal Astrology observations with McWhirter’s NYSE Chart:

I have already established the astrological fact, this timed McWhirter NYSE chart has experienced some of its worst historical price corrections when its Natal Saturn-Neptune opposition is angular in a prominent chart, or its Natal Secondary Progressed Moon puts on hard partile aspects to its Natal Saturn-Neptune 180. Without a doubt, this Natal Saturn-Neptune 180 is the most sensitive aspect in McWhirter’s NYSE Chart for timing severe price corrections with Sidereal Astrology techniques. Also, at times, the angles of NYSE SSR’s are very sensitive to this Natal Saturn-Neptune 180.

I now would like to demonstrate how the NYSE 2007 Sidereal Solar Return (SSR) angles timed the exact monthly top in Oct 2007 for the ‘The Great Recession’ collapse of Stock Prices in 2008. Chart # 1 below is NYSE 2007 SSR. Note SSR Saturn and Neptune are angular, but it is NOT NYSE’s Natal Saturn-Neptune 180 which are angular, but still, this angular Saturn-Neptune for NYSE 2007 SSR timed during its solar year major Saturn-Neptune trouble for Dow Prices.

1: https://imgur.com/36SyeR7

Now note the link # 2 below for the last 20 years bar chart prices for the Dow. All the bars on this chart represent 1 month of the price action for the Dow. Put your cursor on the month Oct 2007 and note t. Neptune is partile 180 NYSE 2007 SSR Saturn, which timed an exact major top (14,198) in the Dow with prices collapsing to a major low in Mar 2009 (6,469).

The major Sidereal Astrology point for this post: We again see SSR angles featuring Saturn-Neptune angular symbolism calling a major top for NYSE’s 2007 solar year.

Also note: 2007 NYSE SSR Saturn partile cnj NYSE Natal Uranus. Ebertin for prominent Saturn-Uranus combo’s:
Irritability and inhibition, tension.
2: https://www.barchart.com/stocks/quotes/ ... tive-chart

:shock: What did McWhirter’s Secondary Progressed (Solar Arc in Long) chart look like on Sept 15 2008 when Lehman Brother’s declared Bankruptcy-- with other Wall Street Banks having to be bailed out by the Federal Reserve from their severe loses? Link # 3 below is McWhirter’s NYSE Secondary Progressed Chart for Sept 15 2008 (inside wheel) bi-wheeled with McWhirter’s Natal NYSE (outside wheel).
*Note NYSE Natal Saturn-Neptune 180 on the Secondary Progressed Solar Arc MC-IC axis. This became partile in 2009 with the major bottom.

3: https://imgur.com/PYB7EeE

More observations later.

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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by SteveS » Thu Mar 21, 2019 7:58 am

Its time for me to digress with my life…
Every movement in the market is the result of a natural law and of a cause which exists long before the effect takes place and can be determined years in advance. W.D. Gann, page 80, ‘How To Make Profits in Commodities Markets.’
Back in the late 70’s early 80’s I studied the Gann material very seriously and came to the conclusion: Gann took his ‘secretes’ of ‘natural law’ in the markets to his grave, so don’t waste your money on pursuing the Gann material being sold over the internet. Without Gann offering specific instructions in his paid for personal teaching classes on how to implement (see) these 'natural laws' in the market place, all of Gann's written material is basically worthless. And one would have to have the understanding of a seasoned astrologer to understand proper workings of these natural laws in the market place. My very first impulse with the field of astrology in my life came by studying Gann’s market material. My cousin who helped me with my study of the Gann material asked a co-worker (happen to be an astrologer) to look at some of Gann’s Master Time & Price Charts, and she told me the Dates on these charts were definitely dates associated with Sun Dates by dividing the calendar year into 24 Sun Dates beginning with the Vernal Point. These were seasonal sun dates, which I proved by an intense study of DAILY market(s) history, very important tops & bottoms occurred to the exact dates of these sun dates. It was a huge mystery to my mind how a ‘natural law’ could govern exact major market tops/bottoms to the exact date of these sun dates. This was the time in my life when I made a final decision to take-up the serious study of Genethlical Astrology, a time birth chart for a human being.

There was another repeating statement by Gann in his written material: Paraphrasing—"It is important to know the timed date for the first trade with any commodity.” Never in all the Gann Material I studied did Gann mention the word Astrology. Now, after my serious study of the McWhirter NYSE timed chart with Sidereal Astrology, I can now clearly see WHY Gann repeated in his work the importance of knowing the first trade of any market.

For the first time in my life, I have proved to my mind with the McWhirter NYSE Chart, and I hope to any other serious students of Sidereal Astrology; theoretically, a Sidereal Astrologer should be able to take the tool of Sidereal Astrology and see into the future any Red Flags pertaining to any type market, as long as one could secure the time of the ‘first trade,’ and this includes all Stocks. The problem: One would probably have to be a Member of the Commodity exchanges, or NYSE to secure this type of timed birth information. :( I will digress with further thoughts throughout this topic.

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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by Jim Eshelman » Thu Mar 21, 2019 8:27 am

So, is that what the Gann dates are? Twenty-four 15° multiples from the vernal point? I never did have a clue what they were and figured you'd tell us if anything clipped along :)

In other words, all Sun passes of 0° or 15° of the Tropical zodiac (another way to say the same thing I said above and not related to zodiacs as such)?
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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by SteveS » Thu Mar 21, 2019 9:37 am

Jim wrote and asked:
So, is that what the Gann dates are? Twenty-four 15° multiples from the vernal point? I never did have a clue what they were and figured you'd tell us if anything clipped along :)
Yes, that is exactly what Gann’s Sun Dates are, and if my life’s path had not crossed an astrologer’s life path, I would never have discovered the truth of Gann’s Sun Dates. But, I only discovered half of this truth which pertained to a specific TIME (exact date) with the future and markets. I never discovered the truth with what Gann was doing with the ‘numbers’ with his Time & Price charts. Gann mentions several times: Major tops and bottoms occur when Time and Price ‘square-out’ with each other. What this means is Price is squaring with these Sun Dates. For a possible example: If Gann saw in the future when Time (1246 weeks) ‘squared’ with Price (1246 $) along with his other important market indicators—he KNEW the market had very high probability for a major top.

I do know this with exhausted historic daily market charts : The Dow vibrates to these Sun Dates for Major Tops and Bottoms! And since I never cracked the Price part of Gann’s ‘squaring out’, I was left with only observing when markets were making all time highs and a technical reversal occurred exactly on a Sun Date—there was high probability of a major top—which was absolutely invaluable to anyone operating in the markets. I was told by Gann’s son over the phone—his father was taught these Time & Price charts in India. These Sun Dates are nothing more than a division of the Tropical Seasons not zodiacs, and Gann was a serious student of the Bible where it was taught 'Everything has its own Season'. Gann spent an extraordinary amount of time researching in detail the price history of any given market!

So, I had to figure out a way to partly apply Gann’s knowledge in a simple practical manner when I was in charge of company pension fund and investment money. I simply looked for when markets were making new highs and used a very discipline technical procedure, and when my technical’s showed a clear reversal in price with my technical’s partile cnj these Sun Dates, I knew with high probability ‘natural law’ was ‘causing’ a Major Top. Same for Major Bottoms. On March 6 2009 (An exact Gann Sun Date) the Dow made a Major Bottom from the 2007-2008 Great Recession Stock Market Crash!

Jim wrote and asked:
In other words, all Sun passes of 0° or 15° of the Tropical zodiac (another way to say the same thing I said above and not related to zodiacs as such)?
Exactly Jim! We are simple talking about our tropical calendar divided by 24 (15 degrees) seasons starting from the vernal point.

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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by Jim Eshelman » Thu Mar 21, 2019 9:49 am

But is it calendars - meaning, even division of days - or celestial longitude - meaning specific ecliptical longitudes? Are we looking for every 15.2 days or for any days when Sun is at Sidereal 5° or 20° of any sign?
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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by SteveS » Thu Mar 21, 2019 10:42 am

Jim wrote and asked:
But is it calendars - meaning, even division of days - or celestial longitude - meaning specific ecliptical longitudes? Are we looking for every 15.2 days or for any days when Sun is at Sidereal 5° or 20° of any sign?
When I was doing my exhaustive research with historical daily markets, I had not discovered the Sidereal Z and was only looking at Gann's Tropical Sun Dates on one of many of his Price and Time charts. There are other Gann Charts which include other Sun Dates dividing the calendar year by 16--not 24.

But, I saw Gann price charts where he would take a trend line for a market with the longitudes of two planets and put them on graph paper and when the exact conjunction of these two planets occurred, the market would top for a large correction. I will try to isolate this part of his teachings and quote his exact words.

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Re: A timed chart for the May 17 1792 NYSE Radical Chart

Post by SteveS » Fri Mar 22, 2019 9:42 am

All of the following Gann quoted words are from his Course on “How to Make Profits in Commodities”:
Squaring Price with Time:
This is one of the most important and valuable discoveries I have ever made, and if you stick strictly to the rule, and always watch an option when Price is squared by time with either daily, weekly, and monthly charts, you will be able to forecast the important changes in trend with greater accuracy.

Bottoms and tops change over a period of years not only because of Supply and Demand change, but because the forces or cause of price change and on account of longitude and latitude. The cycle that it is working in either forms squares or triangles which lower or raises prices according to natural laws which produce the energy that causes the price moves.

If you will take the time to go over any stock running back 10 to 30 years or its life price history, checking all the important tops and bottoms, you will see how well these past tops and bottoms geometrically predicts future important tops and bottoms, involving time and space.

We have astronomical and mathematical proof of the whys for the natural laws causing the working of geometrical angles in the market place. When you have made progress, I will give you further information on the application for these natural laws governing the marketplace.
*Gann's ‘further information on the application of these natural laws governing the marketplace’ was not given in any part of his Course Materials. This is why I quickly came to the conclusion Gann’s Courses are basically worthless. In my opinion, only an astrologer could possible glimpse certain Gann inferences which may offer pieces of Gann’s natural laws governing the marketplace. I do know this: It takes a tremendous amount of time with price history research for any market in order to set-up a possible working view of some of Gann’s natural laws governing the marketplace, and speaking from an astrologer’s point of view—there is no need to waste time on the price history of a given market—unless you have a precise timed date-hour and minute of the ‘first’ trade’ in the market you want to investigate. No different when you want to investigate the natural Sidereal Astrology laws governing the personal time for an individual-you should have an AA Birth Time.

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