Veronica

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Avshalom Binyamin
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Re: Veronica

Post by Avshalom Binyamin » Sat Aug 10, 2019 10:26 am

Skunk spray can't pass rabies.

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Jupiter Sets at Dawn
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Re: Veronica

Post by Jupiter Sets at Dawn » Sat Aug 10, 2019 11:15 am

Avshalom Binyamin wrote:
Sat Aug 10, 2019 10:26 am
Skunk spray can't pass rabies.
It might not have been rabies.

Veronica
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Re: Veronica

Post by Veronica » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:02 pm

Dogs all good.
Still a little stinky.


Had a breakthrough this morning after several culminating months. Or years truthfully.

I really am naive and trusting and giving the benefit of the douvt to a fault. I also do over estimate myself and my place in the world.

My son, bless his heart has been trying for years in his gentle way to tell me.

I heard it loud and clear last night.
The body language
The tone of voice
The words
The hatred in the eyes
The cruelty and unecessary pain.

My daughter is not a mini me at all.
Shes a mini Eric.
The words that came outa her mouth were his....
"I dobt care about how you feel...Im gonna do what ecer I want"

It was so in my face her crocodile tears she has shed for years...all of it...shes a professional gaslighting narcissistic bully.

I tried....she was 10 when I ended it. He had allready trained her to be just like him.

It was crazy to watch last night...hiw she held herself....how she destroyed things...how she so deliberately said every little thing she could to hurt me.

It was so scary.

Cant wait to get over this saturn on my Venus. I wonder what other suprises I have comming in the last sttetch.

I swear it feel like labor pains the waves of sorrow and saddness. Next time maybe i will take that epudural....jk lol.

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Arena
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Re: Veronica

Post by Arena » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:09 pm

Oh, they do get to a difficult rebellious narcissist stage during the teenage, so maybe that's just it.

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Re: Veronica

Post by SteveS » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:30 pm

"Every Rose Has It Thorn."

Veronica
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Re: Veronica

Post by Veronica » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:41 pm

Arena wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:09 pm
Oh, they do get to a difficult rebellious narcissist stage during the teenage, so maybe that's just it.
Angular Uranus and Venus....so rebellion and narcissism are allready fully present....
If being abusive for no reason is this stage.....Im not playing that part in her play.

The scene I saw last night was almost verbatim interactions I had with her father 10 years ago. It was freaky uncanny, how she held her body, the exact phrases, the violent emotional outrage.

I was scared.
But at least I for my part handled tge situation calmly and quietly and asserted myself kindly yet firmly and didnt crumble and cave in nor lose my mental clarity to not stoop to that cruel level.

A big part of my love for her shifted, I mean I still love her but I dont trust her anymore, not with my heart at least.

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Re: Veronica

Post by Veronica » Thu Aug 15, 2019 8:18 am

Another example of the universe finding a way to manifest transits to our chart....

Sitting at home on the couch, I hear a loud buzzing in my ear...dont see anything. All of a sudden out of nowhere a bee flies right down my blouse, gets lost in flesh and fabric...frantically trying to save the little fellow (I love bees they are my favorite insect) he stings me right on my left breast above my heart....still dont see him till he mysteriously escapes and flies over to my bookcase...never to be seen again. Made me cry. It hurt. It scared me. I didnt want to hurt him. Was sad that he felt he had to hurt me...

I really see how the environment we keep ourselces in provides the opportunity for things to come to be. Its gonna come...for sure...but you can control in a way how it is gonna come.


I was curious...
I read Robert Hands Free weekly horoscope over at astro.com for me today (free every Thursday)
In regards to my venus being conjunct transiting Saturn he dropped some language that Ive been concidering...
"Fated relationships" "things now will come to bear in 14 years"

I dont buy the fated relationships....we get what we attract and fate is a very powerless word but one that people on a whole seem to either grasp onto like a security blanket (i know I have) or push away in a very Uranus rebellion and Plutonian go your own way....

But what it did make me concider is that 14 years is about half of a Saturn cycle. Thus I would be led to concider that what he is getting at is that during this massive saturn transit to my natal venus ( and my major midpoint of the sun and moon/ neptune/jupiter which is aspected by my natal Saturn and Uranus)....
That these fruits of my ability to constructively transmute that transit into sonething of goodness and wholeness and to synthesize that with self understanding and honesty ( instead of becoming a bitter old cat woman hag who drowns her sorrows and is unpleasent to the world and shuts out love and her ability to receive and give love)....
Will be apparent in half a saturn cycle when saturn is opposite my venus and I am feeling the effects of that transit again.

But....
(I am getting a big butt)
This saturn transit is about 75% into my Saturn return which occured when I was 29.
That return has brought out many factors for me to deal with, as saturn danced around my chart aspecting dufferent things as she went and now has been sternly looking at my desire nature and affections and the truths and lies about that that I have been living.

Do Saturn returns have a mopping up period as well like a Solar return?

The lessons and expierences that occur hapoen over such a very long time, but they seem so deep and profound and powerful that I would think that before you moce into another Saturn return that you do get some sort of mopping up.

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Re: Veronica

Post by SteveS » Thu Aug 15, 2019 8:38 am

Lot to consider here Veronica with this post. I know this---my first Saturn Return introduced me to the world of astrology.

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Re: Veronica

Post by Veronica » Thu Aug 15, 2019 8:47 am

My first saturn return was when I got the chicken pox, almost died and broke off a 10 year relationship bc I wanted children and not the party lifestyle my current partner wanted.

Edit: a more honest statement..... My biological clock wanted children and I was afraid to have children with my partner because of the high probability that his families genetically passed medical issues would manifest as well as the fact that he IMO drank and used drugs very hard.

I think though that therein lies an issue for me bc....well I dont want what most people do. Im not attracted to popular things and have picky tastes. My biology and my conditioning in this culture though has pressured me to want to want what everybody else does.

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Re: Veronica

Post by Jupiter Sets at Dawn » Thu Aug 15, 2019 11:58 am

I don't believe in "Saturn Returns" in the sense you can calculate your saturn return like you would a solar or lunar return and then read off a theme that your life will have till the next saturn return.

When Saturn returns to the place he held when you were born it's a conjunction between natal and transiting Saturn. It usually lasts a few days, but then it often happens a second time and a third. While those multiple passes occur, it focuses your attention on things you need to work on. That depends on other aspects both Saturns make and what's angular in your chart at the time. But once Saturn has moved on, so will that focus.

Saturn returns happen about every 29 years.
Every 14 years you also get a Saturn-Saturn opposition, and every seven years there's a Saturn-Saturn square. Again, these are aspects and focus your attention on matters that relate to what else is being aspected by the two Saturns, and what's angular. And again, once Saturn moves on, so will you.

That's my opinion, based on my own experience and observations of other people as they go through Saturn "returns" and aspects. Other people claim it has some kind of spiritual influence that deeply affects their lives over a nearly 30 year period. I just don't. I mean I guess you could make that happen by keeping any themes from the actual aspect at the forefront of your like and focusing on those themes in meditation or something for the following 30 years, but that's too weird for me.

Which all leads up to nope. I don't think there's a "mopping up" period for a Saturn return. It's not like you have a PSSatR that progresses 450 degrees instead of the usual 360 over 24 hours. You might be able to have a mopping up period with a Mercury and Venus return (ewww! airy-fairy dust all over that!) but not any planets past the earth. I think instead of looking for mopping up periods, it would be sensible to look at multiple passes because of retrograde motion.

I also think the Saturn cycle, as Saturn aspects your Sun, Moon and the angles is far more important, and the angle crossings are part of what makes relocations work. Move and you move your mundane angles, and when planets cross them, which can change the aspects made when the crossings occur.

Just my opinion, based on my own experience and observations.

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Re: Veronica

Post by Jim Eshelman » Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:47 pm

I agree almost entirely, and especially agree about a Sidereal Saturn Return not being a "map for the next 29.5 years" etc.

However, in terms of "forward impact," I think there is a great deal for similar reasons to those JSAD hinted near the end of her post. The major Saturn-Saturn aspects (at least, several of them - including the conjunction or return) tend to occur at life junctures where many psychologists have discovered most people make significant, epochal shifts in their lives. This is especially true at the last square at around 21; at the "just before 40" Saturn Return; in the middle of the "age of oppositions" around 44 (give or take); etc.

The psychological patterning is that people resist sides of themselves until the pressure becomes too much and, at these junctures, are more inclined to make seismic shifts, usually in an opposite direction (e.g., toward security if they've been living free and loose, or the opposite if the opposite). These seismic shifts tend to form the main framework of the life until another adult developmental crisis hits a few years later.

And after all, what is our Saturn if not our "normative framework." I've seen commonly that Saturn-Saturn transits show us coming up face-to-face against our own previously formed life definitions and (now that we've grown) feeling that they are restrictive - so having to blow them away and reframe larger worldviews.
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Veronica
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Re: Veronica

Post by Veronica » Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:16 am

Thank you both for your feedback and insight.

Robert Hands comment about....things now bear fruit in 14 years....which would be well into my next saturn return, made me wonder about it.

One of the things that I have not been very consciously looking into this SSR, is the fact that while Saturn is conjunct my Venus (and a very important collection of midpoints) it is also very much aspecting my natal Saturn as well as my natal Uranus.

Im sure though that I have been touching those issues, even if not consciously exploring them.

But I have been for a while now because I am well aware that my venus aspecting Uranus Saturn is a HUGE part of who I fundamentaly am.

Its my spice of life in a really acute way.

Yet while in the sanctity of my home I feel safe to let that part of me stretch and sing and dance and love life....

I do not feel safe to do (express myself unrestraint) that in public. I feel that our culture is not civilized, being bound by norms and mores and arbitrary acceptable behaviors. Id be eaten alive or worse, burned at the stake and wasted.

I do know that it feels like its killing me inside, that this beautiful unique spirit I was born to live, isnt.....
That I have to work everyday to contort myself to fit into what this uncivilized world things is good and proper, and its wearing me down and sucking me dry.

I guess though that possibly safety is an illusion.
Its highly unlikely I will be persecuted anymore then I allready have. There isnt really much left for "them" to take away from me, and Im still alive and still have my wits (though I admit to veing highly pliable) and my heart still aches and is so thirty for what my moon says is my appetite.

Im sure with culture being how it is that it must be hard for everyone to truly be themselves and not to fit into the box culture says get into. But I feel inside that I am so outrageous and outlandish and rebellious and freedom loving that Im gonna just burst sometimes.

Steve....here s another funny astrology to contemplate....I went to the car dealership yesterday (again dang mercury) and while waiting to have my car looked at I got my reading book and went to the vack of the lot to sut under a tree and read. After about two minutes I felt this incredible pain, up my pants. Way up...my daisy dukes. I look down and I am swarming with fire ants!! I sat down on there nest which was invisible at tge time and tgose little buggers were all up in my business!! I had to do sone new kibda funky groove to get them out with out stripping down to the bare!! Crazy

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Re: Veronica

Post by SteveS » Sat Aug 17, 2019 9:16 am

My first Saturn Return in 1977 unleashed the heaviest/shocking does of intense fear I have ever felt in my entire life. I think maybe how our natal Saturn's are aspected in our natal's has much to do with influencing a first Saturn Return. I have a 3,49 orb conjunction with Pluto with my natal Saturn, and a partile mundo conjunction. Here is what happened to me in the Autumn of 1977:

1: Discovered my father was a closet alcoholic which began a final separative break-up with the relationship I had with my father.

2: Realized with a heavy dose of reality that the company I was working for was not going to make it financially and had a couple of years left before it would meet serious financial difficulty. I started working for this company when I was 6 years old and figured I was set for life with a solid career. Hardcore Saturn transits has a way of waking you-up to the true reality of a situation—like Veronica recently experience with her daughter with t. Saturn going over her n. Venus. And with Arena's tough Saturn transits she has been experiencing with her now ex.

3: I wanted to report my realizations/discoveries about the bleak financial future for the company to the stockholders, but the President of the Company ordered me to cover-it-up and not report to the stockholders. This began a separative break-up with the President who for many years was like a second father to me. I made up my mind to resign from the company citing different reasons for my resigning—protecting the President of the Company.

There is no doubt in my mind: Saturn has much to do with the psychological influence of fear as one of its negative psychological effects. Hardcore Saturn transits acts as a 'Fear of God' principle. My fear was so deep because of my Natal Saturn-Pluto conjunction I became pathological with many paranormal experiences. These deep paranormal experience led me (thanks to my wife) to a husband wife-team in Chicago. The wife was a high-grade psychic, the husband—an astrologer. This meeting increased my fear—which was the fear of the unknown for me not knowing anything about psychic stuff or astrology. I spent 3 days with the psychic and astrologer and was told so many true things about me and my life, which I thought was total BS, but later with the elapse of time proved to become true. I was told many important books would soon cross my path which would completely raise my consciousnesses in an initiative manner. I was told I would take-up the serious study of astrology with special books. I told myself/wife on the plane back home---no f—king way!!!

The only astrological thing that makes sense to me about what my first Saturn Return did to me by turning my life/consciousness completely up-side down, and my first introduction to astrology in Chicago—was Saturn is place in my 9th House. The Chicago Astrologer told me the 9th House had to do with 'Higher Learning, Higher Consciousness, Philosophy' and the Psychic told me with Saturn in my 9th House with Saturn first transiting Return to my Saturn in the 9th House was timing a complete over-haul of my life---and by God it did time a complete overhaul of my entire life!!! It was like something turned off the lights for the first 29 years of my life, and the party came to a screeching halt!!!

But...I did soon take up a serious study of astrology. :) Saturn is the 'task' master, but/and Saturn cycles are definitely going to teach us something important. Saturn cycles are our 'life lessons' to figure out.

Veronica wrote:
I had to do some new kinda funky groove to get them out with out stripping down to the bare!! Crazy
I understand kid! Ants in the pants will indeed make you do a funky groove. :)

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